General DiscussionAlchemist , let's discuss builds.

i personally go for midas - shadowblade - ac - bkb - manta - abyssal

But that way your damage output would be low during the ac phase of items right ? that's why i go battlefury for the damage

i dont build midas because it delays my battlefury
I usually go for phase > battlefury > sb > ac > mjolnir > abyssal
i go phase for faster ms for farming neutrals

but doesn't skipping midas slow farm alot?

imo, midas is not used for flash farming, but more for faster lvls.
and if u maxed greevils greed first, midas wont benefit much from that.

I see , I'll give that a try next match and see how it goes.

Midas is a waste on a free farming alchemist

@offtopic

look at this game. dk vs alliance

game 1 semi finals http://dotabuff.com/matches/268683084

AM Loda got a 12-13 min battlefury w/treads
burNing also has the same on Alch.
Alch burNing outfarmed him.

game 2 http://dotabuff.com/matches/268737468

Alch Loda got a whooping 2min midas. 12 Mins in He got Treads, Sb and Midas
burNing on AM Only got a bfury.
AM burNing still outfarmed him.

Game 1 Alch bfury.
Game 2 Alch no bfury.

well. thats b-God for you.

Yeah haha

If you can get a good partner, like wisp, leshrac centaur and so on. the stun and acid spray build gives you very great capabilities. It will give you kill advantage, which is way better for an alchemist than greevil's greed gold advantage. especially if you don't have free-farm. don't try to get a midas in all matches. Ganker alchemist is the best alchemist. try getting shadow blade as fast as possible. then obviously good choices are assault cuirass. bkb. ,abyssal blade, MKB if they have evasion. heart of tarrasque. If you have a harder carry who is getting freefarm on your team you can throw carry items away and get items like blink dagger.
Hard farming alchemist can work when enemies don't have a hard carry. alchemist himself is a good carry of course because of his ulti( it increases his DPS by huge 70% at level 3 on average) but regular hard carries can be more useful with even terrible net worth difference.
Even if you go for it. you should come online after you get shadow blade. join fights and grow your advantage as much as you can. don't try throwing the game by farming and missing opportunities to push.

keep in mind that 1-slotted anti-mage can't outcarry 3 slotted alchemist. but 4 slotted AM can outcarry 6 slotted alchemist.

for god sake, stop making battlefury on alchemist, he is one of the rare hero that farm faster with radiance (MUCH FASTER) than with battlefury

^matrice the thing is battlefury comes in small pieces. rushing radiance is much harder, if u just buy a ring of health early u are guranteed to stay in lane and farm well (which later turns into bf). radiance also doesnt allow u to effectively farm ancient stacks

i rather go phase aquilla sb bkb trust my team and get a basher and basher upgr afterwards.. but thats just ap solo queue build. if you're playing a teamgame, trusting in combos and going splash bf damage helps a lot (keeps u in lane too). problem is u can only rly go bf if u r not gonna get ganked as u got no stats and will die in no time even with ulti on, even faster than a druid without items and ulti. bf is usually to be prepared at all times(regen after farm/fight) to fight while letting u flash farm and prepared to fight with your team in your back/front... but thats just me..

My build: Midas, shadow blade, ac , either radiance (if your farming more) or ac then bkb then abyssal upgrade your boots to boots of travel

Here are my 3 usually builds. And probably best,cos most of pro players build same.

Midas,Treads,Shadow Blade,Bkb,Ac,Abysal
Midas,Treads,Shadow Blade,Ac,Bkb,Abysal
Midas,Treads,Shadow Blade,Ac,Desolator,Abysal/Bkb

Midas is not required on Alchemist...but if you can get it early for the extra xp, it is the best choice. Later its not great.

Treads+SB and you are ready to attack.

+BkB and you are ready to teamfight

+AC and you are ready to take rax

+basher...into abysal if its going late

+any dmg items extra...but you better keep farming as you move around because most carries out carry Alchemist after 50+ min. Once you have max items win ASAP.

phase > armlet > lothar > bkb/AC/basher

phase > 4 hyperstones and abysal

Noone here mentioned mjolnir? i fucking love that item on alch. I almost never build a battlefury nor midas, just sb into mjolnir into AC and ready to crush.

Mjol has kind of gone out of favour compared to SB/AC/BKb/Abyssal etc, I used to build it on Alch like 6-7 months ago tho, mmm mjol/ac attack speed vs squishies w/ alacrity from invoker.

Looking at the question you asked, I identified that you are a noob. There ain't a best build, its all situational and relative.

BF is better if you have teammates stacking the jungle or ancients for you. Otherwise, Midas is a stabler choice for good farm (you get it sooner, it doesn't have wasted hp/mana regen, unneeded once you have ultimate, etc.). To clarify, going that extra mile to get the money for BF over midas can be the difference between semi-coordinated opponents just crushing your team versus you coming online soon enough to survive and win. That is what I call "stable," the more surefire thing that still has good odds and relies less on the excellence of your teammates/synergy of your teammates to your cause.

Pick up some boots, PT or phase are fine.

Your next priority is to pick an item that helps you land your incredible stun. It's very long if fully charged, and it does a great deal of damage - especially early on since it is physical damage. Shadow blade is most often used in the way I'm sure you know. It also gives a bit of damage and attack speed.

AC is a solid next item despite having "no damage" as you think (normally). Reasons:
1.) Your stun is physical damage. AC aura amplifies it. (So even if you have "no damage" that is a 360 damage physical hit)
2.) Your ultimate gives you a ton of HP (and regen). The armor synergies with this feature by making your HP more effective at absorbing physical damage.
3.) You can kill anyone in the entire game solo v solo if you have AC, midas, treads, and SB with max stun @ about 20 to 25 minutes. Basically, your "no damage" argument simply turns out to be false. You still hit pretty hard, especially with the high level earned from midas, everyone's low armor combined with AC aura, and the continued level growth from solo hero kills (if they allow you to get them). And of course, they don't, just keep on farming. The -armor helps you farm.

After you have these core items, in general, you are a killing machine as I described. Your only weakness is coordinated disables and magic/pure damage (since your armor is very high). BKB is pretty good in general, stopping most disables and preventing magical/pure damage. Even if you are held in place for the duration of a Bane ultimate while you are in ult form with 22 minute AC and BKB used, the enemy probably won't have enough physical DPS to kill you. They desperately need that magical/pure damage to do so. But your item choice (bkb) depends on the situation (as your whole build does) as well as your level of play. If you are against dumbos who consistently let you pick them off solo v solo (i.e. no team fights will be going on for a while), pick up a basher to make your solo killing power even stronger. Same goes for if they have no disables for some reason and you know you can handle their pure/magic damage. Get that basher to kill in teamfights/solo killing. But BKB -> basher -> abysal is solid. Then troll and go eye of skadii (sell midas for space).

sb. gives you solo kill potential

MJ is good on Alchemist, but SB is the best way first core item...then against good players you need to get bkb...then AC is better then MJ and basher into Abysal is better than MJ...and then at that point you have probably either won the game or need to get something desperate like Divine Rapier to keep up with the DPS you need to win fights...or need a heart or Satanic to stay alive and at that point you run out of item slots.

So, while MJ is pretty good there are just always better choices.

6 mjos = win