Because doom dosent need mana. He needs to either aggro the enemy team or dps or both, and aghnims dosent aid that at all
Its a terrible item. It doesnt help your ultimate at all since a teamfight doesnt last friggn 30 seconds nor is there a hero you want to chase forever, either you burst them down fast or leave them be since you really dont want to overextend.
If you have mana issues you could get shivas (or if u run him as support sheepstick, linkens, euls or whatever u happen to need).
"Because doom dosent need mana." is probably the most erroneous statement I have heard. Doom does require decent mana regen or mana pool. Many people opt for mana boots if they intend to shiva's/refresher.
Aghanims' is a viable upgrade but is situational and depends on how you play Doom. I have done a few different builds on doom and I still am in favor of the upgrade because of how I choose to play Doom but a lot of people either play him as a hard carry or as a semi-support these days and I have seen all kinds of crazy things built on him.
With a lot of heroes there aren't a lot of right or wrong builds but more favored ones because of how the hero scales or has been tried and proven.
One of my favorite builds on doom http://dotabuff.com/matches/447198101 but you could arguable swap the sceptre for a AC if you were inclined. Again, if your good/decent with a hero it shouldn't matter too much what you build and you should be able to do decent it all depends what they have and what you are going for.
You don't get Aghs for duration anyway. You get it for damage. It can be good sometimes when combined with a SB. You can pretty much kill anyone even if they are very tanky.
Agreed.
>No Sceptre = Hero waits then rejoins the teamfight in about 15 seconds.
>Sceptre = Hero doesn't rejoin the teamfight and high chance they will die if they are nearby or you can chase.
Seriously though Doom as a skill isn't all that good and a lot of times people will just wait out the ult if you have nothing to go on. I have even tried a fast level 1 Dagon build to get that quick nuke to ensure a low level kill.
sano is right, without ags duration doom is long enough to focus down/shut down anyone for a teamfight. If you want to tank up, AC or Heart are much better options. Shiva solves mana issues, if you really want to doom people a lot refresher is an option.
When you say doom duration is long enough to shut down anyone who are you thinking of? A crystal maiden?
Lets look at the Doom skill for a second.
DURATION: 15.0
DAMAGE PER SECOND: 30 / 50 / 70
SCEPTER DURATION: 16
SCEPTER DAMAGE PER SECOND: 50 / 80 / 110
The duration of 16 seconds isn't what you are going for here it is coupled with the fact that the longer the Doomed hero sticks around they will never get that spell off. People have varying builds and always talk about armor and damage and stuff like that but once you doom someone that's it the fight is over and you have already eliminated a hero out of a team fight and you want that to last as long as you need it to win a teamfight.
Doom Sceptre - Used to kill ANY hero and can help to improve Dooms usefulness later game.
Doom No Sceptre - Used to briefly silence an enemy hero for 15 seconds in the hope that it will be enough to win a teamfight.
One of dooms main strengths is his "chisel" damage where people are constantly taking damage over time. If you don't go radiance or Sceptre than you are basically just a walking tank with a 15 second silence (at level 16) which makes you wonder why you would pick the hero in the first place.
If you chose not to go sceptre you need to go other items that can add to effectiveness of your Doom skill where they are not just going to back of for 15 seconds then turn on you once it wears off. People always avoid the Sceptre in favor of other items but don't forget it is your ultimate and it is in your best interest to maximize the effectiveness of it whether Doom or another hero.
Doom with sceptor is almost a must nowadays. Cuz so many heroes can survive the doom with allies such as necrophos, mek charges etc.. Doom is more like Venomancer or Night stalker nowadays, they fall off after mid-game. If he doesn't stop carries and opponents mid game from levels 6-12, the game is usually lost. Sceptor does delay other items if you dont' have midas or have allies KSing' ur doomed hero.
I find utility doom alot more useful in general though. Just stack mana and armour on him, and keep either stomp or net - combined with a blink, he can lead an engage and survive long enough to get everything off while most likely tanking a shitton of cc.
He already has one of the highest str gains in the game, so armour actually works really well with him. Shivas/Blink are pickups I find more useful than aghs on him.
if the top 50 doesn't get aghanim,
doesn't need to question it again right? LOL
soul ring/mana boots/bottle is enough to solve mana problem
or maybe refrehser/shivas end game solves it too
Most of the top 50 Dooms are 30-50 games of Dagon/Ethereal trolling in a stack.
Agreeing to disagree cause everyone has their preference and Doom is decently versatile. Soul ring is decently useful.
Get 4 minute midas->phase boots->dominator->ac/shiva->basher/mkb/bkb/heart->rapier
the only way to build doom,
seeing caster dooms is always painful, he has enough disable without any scepters or refreshers
When you get a normal start and eat a wolf, you can typically 4-5 hit a support at 20 minute.
Doom has a single target silence at 6 and has zero disables beyond how you build.
Right clicking dooms are generically terrible because you are playing as a right clicking support killer which serves zero purpose to your team because supports can be dropped in less or no hits by another hero.
On Doom:
Vladamirs > Dominator
Shiva's > Assualt - This is for early game at least which gives you a AOE slow/damage and provides the armor and mana. AC is still a great item to get on Doom.
Basher/MKB/... and other damage items are situational and aren't as standard simply because doom isn't a late game carry and neither is he a good right clicker considering any minus armor and slow will completely wreck you or you will get dominated by the opposing teams carry. Dooms power comes from his ability to weave in and out of team fights damaging and nuking as well as providing auras to the team from stolen creeps and any items he is carrying.
That same item build you suggested above built on a support would equally give them the ability to 4-5 shot another support. Stacking damage gets you kills but renders you fairly useless as a Doom when it comes to actual team composition.
@black lion
It's possible in 2 ways. You lane or you get firstblood.
with the current increase in cost even for a laning hero it is tough to grab a 4 minute midas much less in jungle.
@OA*_Havoc Badger at four minutes you'd better be getting all those last hits and the first blood then.. my best time so far is 6.50 mins and that was with insane ammounts of luck 1 first blood and followup kill.
4 Minutes seems to be a case of insane luck ( or an incredibly good player )
http://www.twitch.tv/dota2_marathon/c/1894037
This is one of my games that pyrion casted. Rapier doom is the only viable build.
It's a shame it's cut off right before the Void got 2 hitted at 20 minute . So much for late game carries.
I agree stacking rapiers is totally viable in Normal bracket http://dotabuff.com/matches/176654339...but when you actually have to play a hero properly in lets say...a skilled level of the game doing things like stacking DPS just won't cut it.
Last 3 games you're still doing a build that was started by EHOME and went out of style quite quickly due to better items choices (halberd over butterfly) aside from that you last played Doom 6 months ago when anything kind of went.
Your game involvement is very low and you seem to just afk farm stupid items then attempt to end the game by "4-5" hitting people but that sadly shows when my Crystal Maiden has a higher KDA and double the games then your rapier stacking doom.
Its not viable, it's just plain low-skill and dumb.
I like to pick up aghs from time to time if let's say I already have shivas, heart, other tanky items and I need just one/two more items for disabling that lategame am, pl, the normal duration doesn't cut it later on.
Aghs isn't bad, it just a lot of other stuff is better. If you want to finish off enemies just get shivas, the slow plus your hellfire aura means no way they are escaping. Shivas helps your mana pool a lot, gives you more aoe and armor is as good as the raw stats on aghs.
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I heard a guy talking about Aghanim on Doom on another forum, saying it's a really bad idea, and good doom players don't get it on doom.
I checked many Top 50 players for Doom, they don't get Aghanim on Doom indeed.
I was wondering why, because I think it's a decent item for doom who lacks mana, and has to absorb damage in fights.