idk man maybe him been good and u been noob is tied to u being 1.5k mmr and he been like divine as u said?
and going to jungle have nothing to do with any of these things u can go to jungle if others are doing fine but if they aren't u just lose if the opponent heroes scale better late game u lose! u can't beat a free farm alch 50-60 min in the game and u can't win everygame by picking a hero u can't properly play such as arc warden no matter if u kill mid 2-3 times or go jungle all the game or not!
idk what u even trying to imply here!?
Well, as you say, your friend is divine. Doesn't that make you feel like you have an amazing resource to use for learning?
I'm not an Arc player, nor a mid player . I'm a safelane core player but i will share what I know about mid, and what I expect from the mid (in a normal/non retard game):
If Our Mid is doing well (Doesn't happen often but according to your last games you usually win it), He forces enemy mid out of the lane, and then takes the mid tower (If they resist, It's just forcing rotations and TPs in which is even better for our other lanes), which opens a path to ganking enemy's safelane. then moves to enemy safelane area (Or Offlane, depending on draft and laning stage) to pressure enemy carry, take the tower there if possible, capture enemy jungle and make it a death zone for them in which they just come and feed(very easy to make plays with mid and safelane tower gone). BUT eventually they lose the fights there because I'm an 4$$#01e and they have to fight 4v5 while I take towers elsewhere and farm. They usually call GG and start flaming each other because someone did something stupid in a fight. Then Enemy does something stupid and I TP in and get an Ultra kill and walk down enemy base and then It's GG. Then I get tons of commends and enemy starts flaming their offlane for letting me freefarm (?!).
All I do is farm and take free towers and free kills while supports set me up for kills and destroy enemy offlane and Mid is doing literally everything in game. I just get real fat real quick thanks to the space created and rest is child play.
Now If the Mid went to jungle because of fear of Stuns and blinks, or didn't force objectives like above, Every advantage I had, would be for the enemy carry and game would be so freaking difficult to win where I'd have to do worse farming patterns to help team push. I'd have to fight tooth and nail in my pressured lane, and escape ganks, while having roamers on my ass everywhere I show up.
Mid heroes are the ones who set the tempo of the game. If you're too scared to do anything in game either don't play mid or change your hero ( Play DP or DK if you have stunophobia). Roamers and stunners can't do jack if they have no map control because mid took the towers away and shoves lanes.
tldr, Be a good mid, win your lane, have map awareness and do shit (Force rotations, Apply pressure, Take towers, Make plays). Dont freaking Jungle (Only do it between real objectives) -.-
I'm trying to push as well, but pushing with Arc is just stupid without Mael+Boots of Travel+SB. And plus, I always felt that the guy is much more aggressive than I am. I'm always trying to win in a safe way, he's trying to win by snowballing. I actually was at 2.2K MMR, until I started playing arc in ranked anddropped significantly. I spam the hero that is not by any means an easy hero or a hero that autowins even in the late game. I'm just trying to figure out whether I lose games with an arc (im at 46% win rate atm with him) cause Im just playing too passively, or just generally am bad with the hero :D
not gonna talk about arc but playing snowball ish agressive core is basically about knowing what can kill you and when they couldn't
(Enemy initiator on other side of the map, enemy TP cooldown, mana, spell cooldown, etc)
just play more and you'll get to feel these stuffs sooner or later as long as you're not playing on autopilot
What are some of the red flags - DON'T GO OUT?
You know they can kill you and they're missing from the map, and you know they can be around
Honestly jungle is completely ineficient and an spending much time there as any hero 7.11 is useless, except for alchemist maybe, but that a whole other story. You should be focused on the lanes and try to farm them whenever you can. Meteor hammer can be a pretty good replacement to maelstrom on arc. It oneshots creepwaves, pressures towers, and gives you a lot of regen and stats to tank you up.
The other thing i wanted to mention is that you cant really compare your friends play on arc to your own because he's playing in a game with average mmr probably 2k-3k below his own. That means that he's gonna outlane the enemy and outplay them at other aspects of the game because he's just way more skilled than them and that allows him to snowball and play as agressively as he wants to.
![[D2F].Johan](https://steamcdn-a.akamaihd.net/steamcommunity/public/images/avatars/07/078661d37e21cd5aaf53fcd5b75178a7754d1ab5_full.jpg "[D2F].Johan")
read recent patch bro. jungling is not effective in this patch. u only go once u have decent damage/levels to clear those camps. staying lanes is always better as it gives you more XP and Gold. if i play mid and my creep wave is pushing behind towers, i go to jungle area to stacks. stacking gives you extra gold, i do this as well when picking up runes or take shrine. it depends the situation. and if giving opportunity, rotate side lanes to gank. you have level advantage on both lanes. so dont scared to do that, you have to evaluate gankable lanes. those having potential kills.
like vandal says, mid laner sets the tempo. play agressive. even you are not doing great at your lane, you still have the level advantage on the other lanes, your rotation is big impact to the team.
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Hey,
Last night, I've played during the down time with my friend. He's in top 600 EU players, and i'm 1,5K. At some point, we played similarly, but I havent played dota for 3-4 years, and now feel that I'm too far behind.
I've noticed that when he played Arc, he was significantly more aggressive than me. I'm trying hard to survive until lvl 6. Trying really hard to save for midas to get it by 6-8th minute mark. Not buying ANYTHING, pretty much. Try not to waste mana, cause I might get stuck with no mana on lvl 6. I don't tend to buy anything for mana besides required clarities.
After lvl 6, I usually kill mid laner 2-3 times and push the lane. At that point, i'm pretty close to getting maelstormor travels in a good game. At that point, I can already see if we lost or not. Its either 0 10 game, 10 0 game, or 5 5. If its 0 10, or 5 5, I tend to stay in the jungle for the next 30 minutes - split pushing most of the time with my second hero, and jungling with the main one. I kinda feel that if I go out with the main hero, I might instantly die due to some long stun, invis hero, or just generally getting in in a position vs 2-3 heroes.
What my friend did is that he started killing mid much earlier, and started to go out with shadow blade. Our entire team including me fed and I know for a fact that games like this I lose as an arc (even if I win mid lane, I lose quickly due to some crazy lineup). The second I die, we lose several towers, and he, seems to be, not afraid to die. He was just a straight killing machine, and I would have just stayed in the jungle.
I know that its probably depends on heroes. Vs blink+stun heroes its just hard to go out.
1. Can you suggest how much time you spend jungling in a game vs blinkers+stunners (e.g., axe, lion)? Like 10% of the game, or 2% of the game, or 50%?
2. How much time do you jungle in games where you know 3-4 people have no escape?
3. What are some of the red flags - DON'T GO OUT?
4. At what point do you know you can just go out with your main vs stay behind? If you're 5 0, would you try to gank on your own or with one teammate? If you're 10 0 and 3-4 levels ahead vs 5 5 and similar lvl as most of the team?